The Recfest Shakers Video

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Episode Summary:

Season One | Episode 22

We took Talentless on the road and dropped ourselves right into the middle of RecFest. Sun out, mics on, chaos fully embraced.

In this episode, we sat down with two of our all-time favorite humans in recruiting, Brooke Freeburg and Krissy Callari from ZRG, and let the conversation do what it does best… wander in the smartest, funniest way possible.

We talked about the realities of recruiting right now, what actually makes this industry fun again, and why relationships still matter more than whatever new tool launched this week. There were laughs, hot takes, and a few “did we really just say that?” moments that make live conversations so damn good.

It was candid. It was chaotic. It was very RecFest.

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Speaker 1 (00:06)

I just want to welcome everybody to the Talentless show where I just had a ficus fall on me. Wreckfest 2025 Nashville, we're doing it folks. We are here with my co-host Ashley King and our impressive guests, Brooke Freeberg and Chrissy Galari. And if this ficus falls on me again, I am literally going to kill it.

I want the ficus to fall on me so I can have a murder scene. It's a third member of our podcast. You know, I love ID and murder. So I should just murder the ficus. Oh, snapped? Yes, like snapped. Oh, oh my God. I am going to snap that.

Speaker 2 (00:33)

This is a

What on earth are you talking about?

The channel ID.

Speaker 1 (00:49)

But I want to, I put them welcome every one of the town levels podcast here at Recfest 2025. We are doing a clock out kind of version of our podcast. We're so excited to have our two favorite people in the room. And so we're going to let them introduce themselves. So I'm going to start with Brooke. Brooke, can you introduce yourself?

Speaker 2 (01:09)

Yes, and I'd like to start with I am not a botanist. I am Brooke Freberg. I am Senior Director of Talent Operations at ZRG Partners, the embedded division.

Speaker 1 (01:13)

Bye!

I

love it. I love it. love it. And Chrissy. Well, hello everyone. Chrissy Kalari. I'm the talent operations manager at ZRG embedded as well. Thrilled to be here. We are so excited to have you. First of all, because you are tweeted. didn't enter. Ficus and me are not from.

Speaker 2 (01:38)

There's the thing.

Ficus leaned into the video this time and was like, hey girl, here's my ass.

Speaker 1 (01:45)

And

for this ficus,

Speaker 2 (01:49)

Her name is Charlotte.

would have known you would have done. literally said her name is Franny.

Speaker 1 (01:57)

Franny. No, maybe it's wrong name. We should have gotten that one. We're here for it.

Speaker 2 (02:01)

We're way off on all this.

fact that the ficus has had more talking points than anyone else here.

Speaker 1 (02:07)

good. know, but let's start in. Let's go. Because, really when we talk about Clock Out and we talk about Talent List, we talk about the journey that you guys have been on in recruiting. And, you know, I know you both very well, but I also want to talk about your journey into recruiting. So, because most of us fell into it, right? We kind of stumbled into that thing. so Brooke, I would love to hear your story first.

Speaker 2 (02:09)

Let's wait in.

Yeah, I like to say, and I start with the story always with in middle school, I signed my yearbooks first girl in the NBA. obviously that that wasn't the case. So I fell into recruiting. But hey, we're still on the path. ⁓ As they say, shoot your shot. Yeah. In the NBA. Well, luckily at that point, you know, we did have the WNBA. But, you know, I shoot. ⁓

Speaker 1 (02:40)

Yum!

Yes!

Yes, yes, yes, yes.

Speaker 2 (02:59)

Shot my shot and missed pretty badly. not until I had my first recruiting job first. You tell us your story.

Speaker 1 (03:03)

Coach broke. Yes.

I'm sorry.

Speaker 2 (03:14)

the

worst. you know, the goal was to be a professional athlete and it didn't work out. And I was home with my parents and didn't want to stay there anymore. So I needed a job. And through a friend from college who was back in New England, which I desperately wanted to get back to said, Oh, you can come work for the company I'm working for. do recruiting. And as everyone, if you ever try to describe your job when you're a recruiter to someone else, what's that?

Speaker 1 (03:39)

They're like, don't even know what's happening.

Speaker 2 (03:41)

So yeah, that got me back to New England and it was my first recruiting job and it was in an agency. That's what I was gonna say. was a contingency agency and I was on the infrastructure team. Also, it was all, you know, this is their early. So it was a lot of desktop, you know, storage engineers, systems admins and systems engineers, that sort of thing. And I absolutely hated it and left recruiting for the next seven years. Whoa.

Boom,

Coaching came in. That's where I was like not quite done with the sports thing yet. So, ball for eight years and then.

Speaker 1 (04:17)

I your story. I've heard it a million times, of course, but I also want to impress upon people that fall into this universe of recruiting that you can fall here and have a successful career. Brooke was actually my boss,

she was such a great boss and a great leader. And I think that you can find leadership and mentor people through athletics. She was always a good coach and a good mentor. So I'm just, I'm so excited to see here, on the talent list.

Speaker 2 (04:44)

Yeah, and I definitely think so one thing that I think is really important about your journey that and even though we only got just a little taste of it, but the part of Recruiting there are a lot of people who think that if you can hit a home run that you can coach the team that if you're the best player You'll be the best coach and that is not the case and so in a weird way even though you Shooted your shoot shoot your shot just because what were you doing? That was the ficus that was short

Speaker 1 (05:09)

Charlotte was talking.

Speaker 2 (05:10)

When

you think that messed up, you're a Charlotte. But here's the deal. But like you took that energy and you were like, if I'm not going to be able to do this, then I'm going to help other people do it. And that's a big piece because that is something that in recruitment, we see so many leaders who were just the best players. They could solve things, but they're not good coaches. They're not. They don't know how to handle people. The skills that it takes to hit a home run are the very different skills that it takes to teach a home run and how to help someone hit it out of the park.

I love that part of your journey

Speaker 1 (05:39)

Actually,

we talk about this all the time. Yeah. Show, right? Like how leaders aren't built for leadership. you know, athlete athletics is great, but like, you know, you have to be empathetic and a compassionate human, which broke. I found that broke. 100%. So like we got to that leadership role and now I've taken, I've taken my journey from, from.

Speaker 2 (05:44)

and snow.

⁓ 100%.

Speaker 1 (06:03)

than to now and it's super exciting and she encouraged me all the way. So I wanna shift to Chrissy though.

Speaker 2 (06:09)

Okay, because these are the women that lift us, y'all, if you're listening. is the community, this is the group. And this is why we love it. This is why we love it. We all are what we are because of people in this room. So Chrissy, lay it on us. Chrissy and Maypee right now.

Speaker 1 (06:12)

God, is the-

What

about your journey, my friend? Mine was interesting. So I moved out to Colorado, started with a small consulting firm in IT. I was doing admin stuff. I didn't want to recruit. Sales. I wanted nothing to do with that. And then I started sourcing, which before that was even probably a title. Pennhunter first came out. So I was helping my recruiters and the owners of the business said, be good at this. They're like, you need to be a recruiter. And I was like, ⁓ please no.

Speaker 2 (06:51)

to.

Speaker 1 (06:51)

I wanted to, here I am. There you are. Maybe something years later. But I loved it because people were happy. You found them jobs. I loved talking to people. So it was the perfect job for me. impact on people's lives, right? Chrissy and I think you feel that. We've talked about this before about how you make an impact on somebody's life. And so that probably really fueled who you were. Because I know you. By the way, I know her.

⁓ sorry. But like, you know, I know that you're an empathetic and great human and you just want people to do better in their lives. And that's super exciting. What was the one thing you were like, why I don't want to get your recruiting because of? I'm like, this is sales. heard my recruiters, they were in tech and they were so salesy. And I'm like, I'm not going to sound like them. That's not going to be who I am.

But then not realizing I could adapt my own style, like how I was talking about roles and clients. So then I love it. And that's it.

Speaker 2 (07:50)

So, okay, so what happened next? So you started in there. What was your next step? Like for both of y'all? So we went, we took our seven years off. Now we're in the place where we're like, I don't wanna recruit, maybe I'll recruit. What happened next? Yeah, I was an okay recruiter. You know, I got the job done, but it wasn't my favorite thing. And I think it's coming back to kind of the coaching aspect. I was more interested in helping.

you know, a couple of years in, the newer employees and newer recruiters make sure they had what they needed for their projects to be successful. And at this point, you know, this was smaller PO embedded. So all of, we're all deployed to different clients and working on different roles across different industries. So it was really important to have a good foundation of tools, understanding of what you're doing and what the best practices are for everything. And then I found myself just being more drawn to that.

than the actual tactical recruiting piece. I wanted to be the one that helped people do their jobs well. that's who I am now. Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 1 (08:48)

operation.

Which is like makes sense in my head, right? Right. It makes sense of where you're sitting right now.

Speaker 2 (08:56)

It relates to coaching a lot, right? Each project is a different game, different teams, different approaches, different strategies. We've got to create our full court press.

Speaker 1 (09:05)

How do you so I stayed in so a lot of my recruiting gate was in Colorado. So then I started my own business with four different partners. So we were doing so.

Speaker 2 (09:13)

Boy,

Speaker 3 (09:14)

hi ⁓

Speaker 1 (09:15)

So

Speaker 2 (09:17)

This a leg.

Speaker 1 (09:17)

we were small, we did it for maybe like two and a half years, then 9-11 hit. So, but we were doing high volume recruiting.

Speaker 4 (09:18)

All right, now let's learn.

Speaker 2 (09:26)

Now hold on, she went from I didn't want to recruit and then you started your own company.

Speaker 1 (09:31)

Yes, we did that thing. Okay, okay, okay. Yeah, we did that. And that was great. And then, and then after that, then I moved back. And then but still looked for recruiting positions, stayed in tech for a while, which I can't do like, oh, I can't.

my god.

So annoying. No, and then after, you know, a couple of years, you know, work for small women owned businesses and that was by myself recruiting. was all telling ups. was doing everything. Yeah. And then took me to corn ferry and then you were telling you that you were probably one of the best recruiters I've ever seen in life. Taking care of clients and, being that person.

And, I want to kind of switch the conversation a little bit because you both work for an RPO. And this is the world we live in right now. Recruiting is tough. Job market is tough. All of those things. I would love to hear your take on RPO on-demand recruiting. Where is that going? kind of like, do you think it's the future? Do you think it's right now? Is that what's happening? Brooke, I'll start with you.

Speaker 2 (10:38)

Yeah, think, well, that's one of the reasons why I did stay with recruiting the second time around. it's been over, you know, I'm over 11 years now with Hub Recruiting slash CRG partners. part of what really drew me and kept me there was the just the changing landscape of what clients needed and how it spanned different roles in different industries. And we could go in and come out and, you know, have really great success. And so we had a great presence in Boston.

kind of pre-COVID. And then since then, and with the ZRG acquisition, I think there's still such a great presence for this type of work because it is so flexible. It really is a great model for companies that need a little bit here and done, need a little bit of a boost, or sometimes it is a little bit bigger and we can do that as well. But I think one of the things we've always prided ourselves on

was our ability to kind of stretch and bend and customize.

Speaker 1 (11:38)

You know, and this weird thing is that now I'm like all fire cylinder, like right going like it's crazy, but AI is coming. Right. And like, so to me, if you don't need a full recruiting team, cause you think AI is going to do your recruiting team doesn't on demand make the most in that universe. Yeah. Yeah. I think that's very true. Right. Not talking in.

Speaker 2 (11:55)

Yes.

Yeah,

you're passing her. timing, it's actual role, like all of those things are flexible. It doesn't have to be 40 hours a week. It doesn't have to be, you know, full life cycle recruiting. It can be any, you know, fractional piece of the process, you know, that a company like us can help with.

Speaker 1 (12:17)

I was just having this conversation about interim solutions the other day about how you put a fractional person in the room. And I think it's same as for a recruiter that you are definitely thinking about how you put the person in the room and get the ROI from that person. Does that make sense? Yeah. And Ash, we've talked about this at length about how you get an ROI from a recruiter.

Speaker 2 (12:43)

absolutely. And I think so one thing for the listeners, if you don't know what RPO is, so RPO is like embedded recruiting. like, don't really actually know what the RPO acronym stands for, but I-

Speaker 1 (12:53)

process out.

Speaker 2 (12:55)

Well,

that's lame. call it recruiters parachutes out because like it's literally parachuting into your company whenever you need them, take care of whatever's needed. And then they're out like, you know, a little SEAL Team 6. So honestly, the way that we all got together was because I was the head of talent at Bevy and needed a same solution just like what y'all offered. And embedded is excellent because there were days that we needed like hot times where we needed 12 recruiters.

Speaker 1 (13:00)

I think the computers.

Speaker 2 (13:23)

And then there were times where it slowed down fourth quarter blues and we only needed one. And our contract allowed us that expandability and contractability. And that's something that's really unique. even just the, we're talking about ROI, ROI isn't always just the recruiter in the seat. Sometimes it's the access that you have to that recruiter and the way that they're set up. Cause there are some contracts, like again, used to in the old days, you would contract them and you have them and you keep them and you have to take care of them.

And now it's a little different. They have a hub like ZRG that they can be a part of and attached to and have a family and just parachute in to our companies when we need them. And that's excellent.

Speaker 1 (13:57)

I think that makes, and that is a great question for Chrissy, actually. What do you think the challenges are right now for on-demand recruiting or RPO or embedded recruiting? you know, is it the access to tools? Is it like management? What do you think that is? Yeah, I think it's the tools. I find that our recruiters that are completely embedded with their team.

They're capturing all that where we're not able to. So the reporting is different. They see the success faster than we do. So having those tools is important for us just across the board. Everybody's doing something different. There's nothing to measure. So you're saying be a true partner. You have to be a true partner. Yeah. You don't want a vendor. You want a partner. You want a partner. Right. And then be called like an agency. You're not an agency. Right. And you're like paying the agency fees and doing stuff like...

Okay, go do that. Don't come over here to RPO.

Speaker 2 (14:53)

Yeah. Can I ask a question? Because I know we're talking about their careers. I do want to ask now that you all have kind of you've made your transition. OK, so I feel like we're at the halfway point. Do we still have more in the career journey? Because there is a question I want to ask. OK, let's keep going on the career journey, because I do have a question where like I kind of want to know, like, what's been your highlight of your journey? So if you want to sneak it in there, go ahead. But I want to hear like what like what was the moment that changed and clicked? And you're like.

Yeah, man, this is where I'm gonna be. This is the door I'm gonna work in my little corner to push open. This is where I'm gonna be. And when, like talk to us about that. How did you fall in love with talent? Because talent clearly loved y'all before it was there.

Speaker 1 (15:32)

I don't know if you're okay with that, but okay.

Speaker 2 (15:34)

I don't think I've thought about this question before. I think it's when it came to the point where wasn't loving the recruiting piece, like actually being deployed and doing the recruiting projects. And when I said, you know, I saw that there were some gaps in our hires, we were hiring a little bit more quickly. We were bringing people into our company who did not have recruiting experience at all. And so that gave me an opening to say, Hey, I can do that.

Let me put together an onboarding plan. And from there, I went from an onboarding plan to L and D getting our first LMS. No, it wasn't. was Learn Upon. Learn Upon was our first LMS. no, wait. Nevermind. I used Learn World. Sorry. We're marketing people. don't know.

Speaker 1 (16:10)

Yeah.

that is who we used to be.

Speaker 2 (16:23)

And then work ramp was second. But that's really where I kind of had my aha moment was like, is it. This is kind of where I want to live. So that was a really big step. you know, shout out to Matt and Tom at the time for being like, yeah, go ahead, do it. Because, you know, to take off half of your billable hours, you know, I was doing 20 hours of L &D and the onboarding in 20 hours.

of billing, recruiting, so they're covering those other 20 hours. At the time when we were 20, 25 people, that's a pretty big deal. it's great on-site location. By the way. how fun.

Speaker 1 (16:57)

With dogs in the office. Yeah. I don't agree.

Look up how recruiting, should see these videos.

Speaker 2 (17:05)

Yeah.

That was it for me. That was them giving me the go ahead to create these kind of processes and systems that really got us from that 2025 up to 40 and 40 and beyond.

Speaker 1 (17:19)

I have so much, so many questions I finished, but I'm to let Chrissy go ahead and give us ⁓ the spiel on that one. know, mine was when I moved back to Jersey. I was looking for a job and like the internet, we were like starting, it wasn't great. I FedExed my resume to a company in Cranford, New Jersey. was a tech company. They were small.

Speaker 2 (17:41)

I already love this effing story.

Speaker 1 (17:43)

I was like, this is crazy. Like I need to, I need to find a job. So I fed accident, they opened it the next day. They called me, they're like, come in for an interview. And I worked seriously with seven guys and then it just clicked. I was like, I'm really good at this. And I was really having a good time with it. And then just, yeah, stuck with it. I was like, this is, but they were great to work with. And unfortunately the...

organization dissolved and I was like, ⁓ man, I didn't want to leave, but I loved it.

Speaker 2 (18:11)

Did y'all's love infatuation, was it ever heavier because of the people around you? Like, do think it was that environment that you went to that they sent you to that made you? So sometimes it's the people around you that, cause I remember we had a client and they were some of the best recruiters I'd ever met. It was in that 2020, 2022 peak where recruiters were on the. You couldn't them anywhere. And we were bringing in.

Speaker 4 (18:34)

like money.

Speaker 2 (18:38)

That was the only time we were bringing in all these new recruiters and some of them were just so phenomenal. And I'll never forget because 2022 Tech had all those huge layoffs and so many of them were like, I will never do recruiting again. And I was like, why? You are so excellent. They were like, and it was their environment. They didn't know they could have better managers, better teams, better resources, just better everything.

Speaker 1 (19:01)

about this all the time about how better leadership, how better teams, how better culture.

Speaker 2 (19:06)

And we would have missed out on these two had they not found their right environment.

Speaker 1 (19:09)

Absolutely we would have missed out on.

Speaker 2 (19:11)

Yeah, I'm glad y'all stay. Yeah. I'm glad you felt like.

Speaker 1 (19:14)

I

love what that's. I'm so glad. I, now we get into this because this is where I was going before. Cause I got my, my bad. It was okay. You know, you do real me all the time. It's fun. All right. Keep going. Spicy. Anywho. So.

You know, I really want to know where you guys see your journey taking you in the next five years. Like that's a hard question for me even. And I hate it in a question if I'm in an interview. So I know it's the worst recruiter questions, but I do want to hear like, and I don't mean like leaving your job or like, is your like.

Speaker 2 (19:52)

employed

in general. 2025. That's the state we're in. Like state number one, be employed, then you get to pick what you want.

Speaker 3 (19:57)

Like a

Speaker 1 (20:02)

Alright.

Speaker 3 (20:02)

Peace.

Speaker 1 (20:04)

Okay. So, you know, like I just mean from like a trajectory and like where you want to upskill maybe or something like that. Brooke, I want to start with you.

Speaker 2 (20:13)

Yeah. What's the new shooter shot? Yeah. What's new shooter shot? We want a shoe. What is it? I think I'd like to transition a little bit away from the project management piece and dig into more of the, well, first getting back into more learning and development, professional development. It's always been kind of my heart place. But aside from that,

Speaker 1 (20:15)

The ⁓

⁓ Shady.

Speaker 2 (20:35)

In order to do that, you have to understand the business better. have to understand performance better. You have to understand what's working in the industry. And I think that's one of the things that I'm lacking, at least in the experience right now is some of the analytics and using data to drive new strategies and drive. It'll never be the primary point for me. mean, I think data has its place. tells its stories, but I also want to keep it. ⁓

Speaker 1 (21:00)

You just did the Ashley thing. She's

about to go ham. Activate it! ⁓

Speaker 3 (21:05)

So.

Speaker 2 (21:05)

I

got my data hat on. Whatever I said talk nerdy to me, I wasn't.

Speaker 1 (21:08)

head about.

I'm

like, she who? I know. This is why we have her on this show.

Speaker 2 (21:18)

Well, it's also why she keeps me cut off so I don't take the whole show up and be like, let me tell you about the data, about the free point. Okay. Yeah. Go on, Brookie. Leave us a little bit more. I mean, you it's an important part of the business. You need to refer back to something. You can't just say, Ashley was a great recruiter. mean, she got the job done. Her client loved her when, you know, she closed one out of 10 racks and you know, other whatever. Ashley, you need to know this whole story.

Speaker 1 (21:42)

You don't look

Speaker 2 (21:45)

I can say about Chrissy that Chrissy would have never done that. Chrissy never would have. Ashley on the other hand, she'll let you high and dry. 25 racks, one fill, baby. I'm kidding. know. Hey, listen, my data speaks for itself. That's why I'm cool joking.

Speaker 1 (21:53)

No! ⁓

This is the thing with I don't even say with this thing. I know. No, we're doing a shoulder thing right now. ⁓

Speaker 2 (22:05)

I'm

percent sure LinkedIn reached out to me and was like you're a top one person of users This was with y'all I think and they made me host a class for their salespeople to teach them how to ⁓ Okay, you're actually question no, I'm just kidding It's Charlotte Franny

Speaker 1 (22:17)

Okay, okay. Not the Ashley show.

Hahaha!

my God, this she's ficus everyone. just want everyone to know in my life that I love gardening and love plants, but this ficus is ⁓ an enemy. she, I know.

Speaker 2 (22:35)

And that's right,

we gotta take it to Chrissy.

Speaker 1 (22:41)

Jesse, so I'm sorry. we got to Recharged.

Yeah, that's happening. Not happening. ⁓ no. When the lottery. ⁓

Speaker 2 (22:47)

Hey, we're shooting shots. Let's just shoot it.

Speaker 1 (22:54)

Five years, if I were going to leave recruiting, I would love to start some sort of business. The younger recruiters coming into the world, how to do it and the right way. ⁓ There's only, there was a thing.

Speaker 4 (23:06)

That's what I'm talking about.

Speaker 1 (23:21)

I said.

Speaker 2 (23:22)

You know how many people we've talked to and they say this exact quote, there is no such thing as a recruiter school. So there's no one way of containing them. And they sound like that too, just in case you're here. But the most important thing is they're exactly right. There is no school. this is a

Speaker 1 (23:31)

I'm good.

Speaker 2 (23:37)

thin layer of individuals that impact our social, our occupation status, our ⁓ salaries, our everything. Wage. Generational wealth. Everything that happens. And it's interesting because 25 years ago was about the point whenever we have gone from paper pusher admin and starting in the strategic partnership place.

Speaker 1 (23:46)

you

Speaker 2 (23:59)

And in that, we have taken on a lot of macro responsibilities that we have not educated ourselves for. And so this thin layer of people, they think they're doing a great job whenever they negotiate 5K off of someone's salary, because their business has sold them, that's the right move. When in reality, that's 5K off of a family that could use it way more than your Fortune 200 or.

Speaker 1 (24:22)

It's about people's lives.

Speaker 2 (24:23)

Exactly.

But we've been focused on the wrong, you know, it's always been protect the company, protect the company. And now it's time to ask, what's the company profits or people?

Speaker 1 (24:31)

You

know, I remember when my mom was like, like my mom was doing the thing, like they had a pension and they had all these things. We don't have that. We don't have any of that. So why aren't you so loyal to an organization that literally is not loyal to you as-

Speaker 2 (24:40)

No.

Well, not only that, but they've infiltrated your life. They're on one of our phones. We're not OK posting in whatever we want because we work for them. We can't. So let's not act like it doesn't like that's why I say we of all people, this thin layer, they have gotten to start acting up. They've got to start getting right because we are hindering our damn selves. All of us are living under this guise that we've all set ourselves. So hey, it's time. So we're.

Speaker 1 (25:12)

We're going

to do a little bit of rapid fire. Yeah. Yeah. mean, no, yeah. Charlotte. The ficus, by the way. ⁓

Speaker 2 (25:25)

I got that

weird energy, you what mean?

Speaker 1 (25:28)

So what is what, what one recruiting trend would you be like? I really love it right now.

Speaker 2 (25:34)

I don't know if it's a recruiting necessarily trend, but hiring trend reference checks. hot take. I agree. Because they never give you one that's crap. They know it's a waste of time. It's probably their three cousins. Like, yeah, way too subjective.

Speaker 1 (25:48)

Okay,

let's go. Interview process. Way too long. ⁓ yeah. after panel. No. Yeah. I would be like the panel interview. I think if you put somebody in a room and you make them sit with five people, it's like annoying. It is. It's like, what is, you want them to talk to five people over Zoom? Right. Like.

Speaker 3 (25:52)

Yes, they will.

Speaker 2 (25:53)

Bye.

that but what's the value? Like at that point we're just appeasing our stakeholders so they can check a box but none of them are actually assessing like we're assessing the same questions over and over just for people to go off a gut vibe and it's like that's not science y'all and we're again now a strategic partner we have data we know numbers we can use like psychological sciences go you're I'm ready. it a is are we asking more questions? I want to know what was the weirdest job you ever recruited for?

Speaker 1 (26:28)

Ready? You ready for it?

Boom. That's a good one. The radiologists. Oh my God. Minneapolis, Minneapolis. were making, I could hire, could pay them $800,000 a year. Couldn't find anyone. For a day. Right. Yes. Yes. I did that together. Oh my God. was, it was.

Speaker 2 (26:36)

and tell me.

and

and radiology.

We ever fill it or should we fill it now? Oh, hey, we have an 800,000 A millionaire for a right now. They was only make like 75k exactly We all in Minneapolis. I don't know what's happening

Speaker 1 (26:59)

A year job.

Why?

We

could not find it. We did not have it. was wild. was wild. Wow. 2,500 candidates by source. Minnesota. I'm sorry, Minneapolis. Minneapolis people, I love you. I know, love you. I love you. It's just that no one wanted to...

Speaker 2 (27:12)

That's wild.

And not a, what's a good ditch?

Half as proud from Minnesota. Me and he's sold.

Okay,

so she had to recruit a radio. Okay, Brooke, what was the weirdie? Executive assistant. Really? I interviewed 95 people and not one made it past the first.

Speaker 1 (27:31)

billionaire

Bye.

Was that what they want? ⁓ what was the.

Speaker 2 (27:47)

CEO

so particular. I've never interviewed so many people for one role and came, did not come close. And just he kept me on it. And it was like 10 hours a week. wasn't something I was doing 40 hours a week, but think of the inbound application. Think of even the sourcing. But whenever you're looking for an executive assistant, it's so like any skill. It's the most difficult.

Speaker 1 (28:09)

us.

Speaker 2 (28:16)

And frustrating. Well, I ever worked on it. am still. I am impacted by this. fact that I couldn't, I didn't feel an executive. I was still.

Speaker 1 (28:21)

that we're talking about. ⁓

By the way, she needs therapy.

Speaker 2 (28:35)

If I was in the, I always, it's pre-COVID and post-COVID, right? It's- Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So was I home? Yeah. And I'm pretty sure I was in the office of 2019 I'm thinking 2019 and 2020. Wow. That's rough and tumbling.

Speaker 1 (28:46)

down.

To bring it back to breakfast. that's I don't know what's happening right now. Folks. I'm to bring it back to breakfast 2025 and say, like, I want to know what you're excited to see and do. Like, what do you

Speaker 2 (28:50)

I'm just kidding.

If

we're in the animation space and we're in an environment that is here for our talent, what's the coolest thing out there you think? And why is it talent ed?

Speaker 1 (29:12)

This year I love it's bigger. So many great people here. Yeah. Yeah. Just to talk to everybody. I want to meet new people, you know, get to know them, get to know their stories. This is what this podcast is always about. Right. Is it the stories of recruiters who are living in the world that we live in today and their challenges and their fight for what we're doing today. And this is a great place to do it. I'm glad you're here to see it. And I love that answer. Brooke, what are you excited for?

Speaker 2 (29:33)

So.

Yeah, I think it's a mix. think it's one, it's for me getting more familiar about what's happening within the space. Not just AI, but some of the other tools and a lot of the speakers I'm pretty psyched to hear as well. So I'm hoping to learn something, right? If I learn something from everyone that I talk to or every booth I go to, I think that makes it worth it. But, know, I think Christy said early, you know, we are in search of tools that will fit our business.

That's hard because our business is not.

Speaker 1 (30:09)

I'm going to tell you for, for if you're going to make a tool right now, make it for RPO. Yes. don't know. Why are we all? I don't know.

Speaker 2 (30:15)

Why are secret sauce? Why aren't we?

See y'all in lab. We need to get back to the lab. We're going back to the lab.

Speaker 1 (30:20)

Sorry, going back to the lab.

I'm sorry folks, not doing that. But seriously, like there is not enough out here for on demand talent. And I'm going to tell you this. I believe that this is a future of how we work in the future because there is going to be contract hires everywhere. And so when you have to speak to someone, stop making for those in-house people think about how you tailor it.

to someone who has a tail or something to every single client every time. That is a hard position to be in. It's hard to find a tool for it. It's hard to do that work. And every day, these two lovely humans have to sit in that and be on demand for every single client that they have. And that is a huge position to be in. So please, as you're thinking about talent, you're thinking about AI, you're thinking about...

What to make next and you better not be making it if you're not in talent. ⁓

Speaker 2 (31:18)

Yeah, please

stop. If you're a miniature, if you're like Doddler. I hired someone once. And I got to do it. I could make them. I know. Let me tell you the logic. This is I got my teeth cleaned. I'm a dentist. And it's like, no, no, you're not. Don't do that. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (31:23)

Please stop. Just stop. I hired a guy?

at the corner store and so I thought

don't

do any of that, but if you are a real person in talent and thinking about the next step and you're like, I want to create something creative for that space. Cause I do believe the on-demand talent is going to be where we live in this new future where we live in with AI and all this craziness. it was so lovely to have these beautiful people on, but they live in it every day and they don't have the tools and

the response that they need to do the work they need to do for their clients. So please think about.

Speaker 2 (32:09)

Well, and not only that, but I will say so if you haven't found Brooke and or so Brooke Freeberg or Chrissy Kalari. thought. I will do a plug party, but I'm plugging in something else because I'll tell you right now, Chrissy Kalari is, oh, out of office. that lovely lady is taking client calls like early morning. She is like, and even her clients are like, I'm sorry, I'm not yet the conference. And she's like, listen, I got time. She's like, I have made space for you.

Speaker 1 (32:16)

We did. Do the stupid plug-in.

What the?

Speaker 2 (32:37)

Do you need and that is the type of people because I'm going to tell you right now, I work in a corporate. I work at right now at a Fortune 200 company. I have 200 recruiters dotted line to me and half of them are RPO. And there is such a difference because internally they see them as a separate group. I see them as very much still our recruiters and our salespeople and the people that we have to connect with. It makes or breaks.

Speaker 1 (33:03)

Make him a part.

Speaker 2 (33:04)

So

literally, if you have these two in your corner and need RPO, these are the client individuals that you want. Where this is a partnership. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (33:13)

You want to,

this is a true partnership and how we talk about not having those individual relationships with agency and contingency fees and I don't know what else you got going on, but this is how you do it and you do it respectfully. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (33:30)

Have you ever met someone in talent that you were just like, they made you love it. And you're like that, like whether it was who you met Brooke when you're enablement stuff, but like, is there anyone along your journey that if you had to have a moment and just say, Hey, I would like to give some gratitude to this person because I'm in this evening because of where they. And I think we need to recognize the good ones because again.

Speaker 1 (33:48)

What a question.

Speaker 2 (33:53)

There's so much loudness in the ocean. need to start setting up a lot. So who would you say in your environment has helped you shaped you anything like that? And if you're like, just my mom, that's fine too.

Hey, shout out. Deseret's my hey. Also my pop. Oh, pop up. Yeah, up. OK. What's up? Good. OK. I think. Now, using the word love is a little bit is a little bit heavy, but it's heavy. I would say that was a true mentor and that showed me how to really be successful and kind of what it took.

Speaker 1 (34:08)

Yeah.

Bye. ⁓

Speaker 2 (34:28)

Um, I would have to give, I'd get a big shout out to Anya Cromie. So when I started with, hub recruiting, there were only, I think there were four or five sales people, maybe five or six recruiters. you know, I think I was hired 10 to 12, something like that. And Anya was kind of really stuck me and, and you all know Anya, um, you know, she's a very.

Her personality is amazing. She's hilarious, but she's also very good and serious about her job. She has her ways in her process. I tried really hard just to be kind of a sponge for that because it had been seven years since I'd done any serious recruiting and this early stage kind of RPO was much different than the contingency firm that I worked for. I was really not.

Speaker 1 (34:58)

She's great at like.

Speaker 2 (35:18)

two weeks I was happy to have a job because I was unemployed at that point. But the idea of going back to recruiting at that time made me very nervous. The model made me nervous because it's a, you know, it's a contractor model. So you're only being paid and working when you have a project. So there were a lot of risk for me at the time jumping into it. And so to have someone who was so good at it.

sitting across from me and you could hear peer to peer interviews here that did everything how all of that was probably a big reason why you know I was like I said it was decent I was okay but I wouldn't have been anywhere near even not if it wasn't if it wasn't for all I foundation

Speaker 1 (35:58)

of set out

on yeah she's the head of delivery right now for ZRG embedded recruiting in RPO so shout out

Speaker 2 (36:08)

She was higher number three there. I remember that Tom and then on. Yeah. just want to ask, because now we're in 2025, so many people don't work in the office. Do you think like do you think you could have achieved that? Had it have been like today? Probably not. I think I probably would have had the same general type of journey. I mean, yeah, now, I mean. So it really shaped it. Yeah. Wow. I love that. Eventually, would have.

Speaker 1 (36:32)

That's an interesting take, right? Like we did, you know.

Speaker 2 (36:34)

Yeah, because now because that's an issue I have with the figures all differently. No, no, no, you're right. If I we were if I was remote and tried to do that with on your absolutely would be different. It would be absolutely different. Yeah. I misunderstood the question. girl. I don't even know my question. I do. Take it wherever you want. I and had no idea. You're a solid. Anyone? No, no one's listening to my question. My question was crap. It's not happening. It's not happening.

Speaker 1 (36:48)

So.

Thank

I know. Yeah. Boom. love it so much. least favorite question. Grizzy. Fine was, and she's, she's a good friend. Actually, it was her and her husband, Bonnie and Tom Johnson. So they live around the corner from A to Z. But Bonnie started her own tiny little life sciences, little consulting, right? It was.

Speaker 2 (37:00)

Back to

My solution so far, obviously.

Speaker 1 (37:25)

Myself, her, she was doing the sales and her daughter-in-law was a part-time recruiter. It worked for her for seven years. She, I don't know, it was just something about her, the way she like spoke to me. She was a mentor, still to this day. We've been friends for, my God, close to 15 years. We have dinner every week, but it was just the way she guided me through, you know, either each contract or each conversation brought me on client calls all the time. We went to Johnson & Johnson and

A true leader. Yes. Yeah. She absolutely was. And still, I'll go to her. There's anything that's like blowing up that I'm not comfortable with. And she just, we just fuck it through. It's amazing. I'm just sad no one said it was me.

Speaker 2 (37:54)

She

I'm not. I mean, yours. Don't say me. God, don't. I know. I know. It's really sharp. It's sharp. It changed my.

Speaker 1 (38:10)

Why would I say that? I'm

just sad that I'm not that impressive. how do you ask that? No, no. It's too late. Hey, it's

Speaker 2 (38:23)

Who

was your influence? Yeah, on your journey.

Speaker 1 (38:25)

Who was my infamy stage name?

Yeah. So I had this wonderful guy, his name was Sam. And I talk about him all the time. And I was in agency at the time and he was just like, I don't know. He was like, you know, I'm competitive. No. And like, desert. Not at all. But I was like super competitive and he was competitive and we like just.

Speaker 2 (38:42)

Golden? All company?

Speaker 1 (38:49)

bonded on like making lives happen. And we used to always talk about like the impact on people's lives. And we used to go eat like banh mi. And it was just like a weird, it was a weird relationship. But Sam, if you're listening, know, how about you?

Speaker 2 (39:06)

I'm gonna have to say that I've never actually said his name on a podcast, I don't think. But I actually started my recruited journey in IT staffing and they took us to like this two week bootcamp. And one of the gentlemen who was the head of the whole thing and the head of the whole business, his name was Matt Chamberlain. And I'm not gonna lie, that week, whenever we finished, they took us on a one-on-one to tell us like where we needed to fix ourselves or whatever.

Speaker 1 (39:23)

Matt.

Speaker 2 (39:31)

And all three of the directors took me in the hallway and they were like, the only thing we have to say is you are either going to be the biggest thing that ever happened to talent acquisition or you're going to absolutely destroy the industry.

Speaker 1 (39:42)

Okay, wow.

Speaker 2 (39:43)

Okay, here was why. okay, first of all, I was a child, so I called one of the directors bro on accident. And so he was like, and so it kind of had to do with that, where like, you're either gonna be the best or the worst. But you know, from there, he took me to a few other companies. And at the time, and if he's, I doubt he'll ever listen to this, but if it is, fine, you can take this and put it in your pocket, At ⁓ I don't think I knew what I had when I had it, you know?

Speaker 1 (40:06)

At the

Speaker 2 (40:09)

but he was a genuine manager who actually gave a shit and fought for his talent team, ⁓ fought for his recruiters. And I don't think I knew what that was till it was gone. And so, you know, something he taught me, everything that I have for whenever I push back on managers, whenever I'm like, no, using data, business case creation, everything like that to make a point and make change, I learned from him. And,

Yeah, so like from the jump, like 14 days in, the dude was like, all three of them, they were like, something's here. So he kind of planned to deceive from the jump. that. You can have it, man.

Speaker 1 (40:45)

love that. That's

amazing. Man, I hope you're listening to this. So big as a podcast. I know. No, no, no.

Speaker 2 (40:49)

He probably doesn't.

We have

the trees. We speak to the trees. I am the morax.

Speaker 1 (40:58)

I'm really mad about this Ficus. She's chilling with She's chilling with you. Anywho. So today at the end of the day, we are doing plug party for Brooke and Chrissy. So I, you know, this is your time to shine and tell us where we can find you, what you can do, all the things like how to connect with you. We don't know what people to connect with you.

Speaker 2 (41:00)

She shouldn't be, she's chilling.

Speaker 4 (41:19)

Actually, by the way.

Speaker 2 (41:21)

you

Speaker 1 (41:27)

Do

it so i'll start with you, Chrissy let's do the blood party. yeah well, you can see me on a green skirt pink sneakers walk around. watermelon. cutest. No seeds, by the way, no seats. comfortable. yeah catch me when i'm walking around linkedin. yeah i'm linkedin trying to post more get more be more visible, so please reach out.

Speaker 2 (41:46)

I'm

sorry. Is it Chrissy? It's K R I S S. Yes. ⁓

Speaker 1 (41:50)

Okay. Are

I that's that's it. We are already stalkers.

Speaker 2 (41:58)

Yeah, I mean, everything Chrissy said except for, you know, connect with me on LinkedIn and not her for me. Finally walking around here, I'm best probably confused and hot and trying to find myself. Anyone who's confused is probably me. And then anyone else, not just talking about talent, but you know, let's talk dogs. Any former at-hoc.

Speaker 1 (42:19)

It should have been about dogs.

Speaker 2 (42:20)

To be honest, we would have gone over the

Speaker 1 (42:22)

I know. this is a great episode of the talentless podcast. I am Desiree Goldie and this is Ashley King.

Speaker 2 (42:25)

I don't know if it would have got it. Folks, this is-

Yes,

she is. Yes, hey, this is a podcast about the ladies who make us and make the world go around. we are so excited. This is our second year we're here with Brooke and Chrissy and every single time is an excellent party time. And I cannot express this enough. I have had them as business partners. I have had them as vacation getaway to conferences and I've had them as excellent friends. And I will say that you want them in your back pocket. So if you are listening,

and you're like, man, we have recruiting stuff that we just need. That's your call. Do it. Do it. Find your friend.

Speaker 1 (43:07)

We're clocking out. Woo!

Speaker 3 (43:09)

Thank you!